How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008 - FMVperformance.com : The site for all your Ford Mazda and Volvo needs
 
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 05:48 PM Thread Starter
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How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

April 2008 Issue

Category: Sedans Under $20,000
Honda Civic EX (MT) 1st
Hyundai Elantra SE 2nd
Mazda3 i (MTX) 3rd
Mazda3 i (ATX) 5th

Category: Sedans $20,000-25,000
Mazda6 i 11th

Category: Sedans $25,000-30,000
Mazda6 14th

Category: Roadsters under $40k
MX-5 Miata 1st
Honda S2000 2nd

Category: Sports/Sporty Cars
Mazdaspeed3 1st
VW GTI 2nd
Mazda RX-8 3rd

Category: Wagons and Hatchbacks under $25,000
Mazda5 touring 1st
Mazda3 s GT 2nd

Category: SUVs Under $30,000
Mazda Tribute 18th

Category: SUVs $30,000-40,000
CX-9 touring 12th
Cx-7 touring 19th



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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 06:31 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

Mazda kicks ass, but CR is shit. Each issue is just a cookie version of the previous issue, especially about cars. I think I've read under cons for the Mazda 3 "Gauge illumination and poor safety rating w/o side air bags" like 50 frickin times.

Kyle, 2006 Mazda3s GT
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 07:42 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

Looks like Mazda did pretty well, but I agree with kjh1127.

CR is known for their biased reviews, but people that know about cars, know that some of the stuff they say is ridiculous and makes Honda and Toyota look like the super-cars. (I'm not saying they make bad cars, but you'd think they're near perfect if you believed CR).



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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 07:54 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

A Hyundai did better than us? :shock: A sure sign they're stacking the deck...


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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 08:56 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

[quote author=Alec Trevelyan link=topic=105926.msg2158722#msg2158722 date=1205798042]
A Hyundai did better than us? :shock: A sure sign they're stacking the deck...
[/quote]

Nah, they just look at value per dollar, and they value driving fun less than your typical Mazda driver does. By their criteria -- and they're pretty up front about what their criteria are -- the Hyundai is a swell buy. Your criteria may differ from theirs, hence, so may your opinion.

Interestingly, though, sporty car champions Car & Driver likely share your criteria, and they awarded the Hyundai Elantra their number one small car spot a few years ago, one spot ahead of the previous-generation Mazda 3 series and several spots ahead of the previous generation Honda Civic.

It's absurd to call Consumer Reports biased. They are fully subscriber supported -- they don't accept advertising, so what's in it for them to be biased? This is quite a contrast from commercial car mags that are trying to ingratiate themselves with mfrs. to sell ads. Nor can a manufacturer game the system with CR: CR does not accept test cars from manufacturers -- they actually go and buy cars new off the lot, without saying they're from CR, so they get a typical production car just as you would. This is quite a contrast from commerical car mags that get free test cars from mfrs., which can be subtly tweaked in ways the production car isn't, e.g. when Ford allegedly cranked up the boost pressure in its supposedly 140 hp Probe to give more like 190 hp for the test car they were passing around...
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 09:04 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

[quote author=friedputty link=topic=105926.msg2158853#msg2158853 date=1205801807]
[quote author=Alec Trevelyan link=topic=105926.msg2158722#msg2158722 date=1205798042]
A Hyundai did better than us? :shock: A sure sign they're stacking the deck...
[/quote]

Nah, they just look at value per dollar, and they value driving fun less than your typical Mazda driver does. By their criteria -- and they're pretty up front about what their criteria are -- the Hyundai is a swell buy. Your criteria may differ from theirs, hence, so may your opinion.
[/quote]

Heh, just a little


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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-17-2008, 10:58 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

[quote author=friedputty link=topic=105926.msg2158853#msg2158853 date=1205801807]
[quote author=Alec Trevelyan link=topic=105926.msg2158722#msg2158722 date=1205798042]
A Hyundai did better than us? :shock: A sure sign they're stacking the deck...
[/quote]

It's absurd to call Consumer Reports biased. They are fully subscriber supported -- they don't accept advertising, so what's in it for them to be biased? This is quite a contrast from commercial car mags that are trying to ingratiate themselves with mfrs. to sell ads. Nor can a manufacturer game the system with CR: CR does not accept test cars from manufacturers -- they actually go and buy cars new off the lot, without saying they're from CR, so they get a typical production car just as you would. This is quite a contrast from commerical car mags that get free test cars from mfrs., which can be subtly tweaked in ways the production car isn't, e.g. when Ford allegedly cranked up the boost pressure in its supposedly 140 hp Probe to give more like 190 hp for the test car they were passing around...

[/quote]

You don't have to have an incentive to be biased. It's just difficult for me to read their reports because even a CR spokesman said


"With Honda and Toyota, because of the consistency of the vehicles, because we see carried-over content and existing platforms, we are able on a regular basis to recommend new vehicles more often than we are with domestic manufacturers."

So any new vehicle, or new platform vehicle, really doesn't stand a chance. Not to mention, their tests are single-sample, have no scientific process or method, and their "rating scale" of red to black dots are completely subjective. There also isn't a scale factor whatsoever. I know others may have different opinions, but if you actually read their articles, look at the pros and cons, look at the ratings, you'll quickly understand the flaws in their rating system. I think CR tries to pass its reviews and ratings as "the truth" about cars and trucks, but really, it shouldn't be used more than a review/guide.


http://www.allpar.com/cr.html
http://www.automotivedigest.com/view...ticlesID=21666
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16696069/



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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 03-18-2008, 08:49 PM
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Re: How Mazda Faired in Consumer Reports for 2008

[quote author=UnderEstimated link=topic=105926.msg2159131#msg2159131 date=1205809133]
[quote author=friedputty link=topic=105926.msg2158853#msg2158853 date=1205801807]
[quote author=Alec Trevelyan link=topic=105926.msg2158722#msg2158722 date=1205798042]
A Hyundai did better than us? :shock: A sure sign they're stacking the deck...
[/quote]

It's absurd to call Consumer Reports biased. They are fully subscriber supported -- they don't accept advertising, so what's in it for them to be biased? This is quite a contrast from commercial car mags that are trying to ingratiate themselves with mfrs. to sell ads. Nor can a manufacturer game the system with CR: CR does not accept test cars from manufacturers -- they actually go and buy cars new off the lot, without saying they're from CR, so they get a typical production car just as you would. This is quite a contrast from commerical car mags that get free test cars from mfrs., which can be subtly tweaked in ways the production car isn't, e.g. when Ford allegedly cranked up the boost pressure in its supposedly 140 hp Probe to give more like 190 hp for the test car they were passing around...

[/quote]

You don't have to have an incentive to be biased. It's just difficult for me to read their reports because even a CR spokesman said


"With Honda and Toyota, because of the consistency of the vehicles, because we see carried-over content and existing platforms, we are able on a regular basis to recommend new vehicles more often than we are with domestic manufacturers."

So any new vehicle, or new platform vehicle, really doesn't stand a chance. Not to mention, their tests are single-sample, have no scientific process or method, and their "rating scale" of red to black dots are completely subjective. There also isn't a scale factor whatsoever. I know others may have different opinions, but if you actually read their articles, look at the pros and cons, look at the ratings, you'll quickly understand the flaws in their rating system. I think CR tries to pass its reviews and ratings as "the truth" about cars and trucks, but really, it shouldn't be used more than a review/guide.


http://www.allpar.com/cr.html
http://www.automotivedigest.com/view...ticlesID=21666
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16696069/


[/quote]

Vehicle ratings are subjective by nature -- cars are not widgets; they evoke human responses, and indeed, it's those human responses we often seek to capture in order to evaluate many aspects of a car. Nobody should take the evaluation of a single source, be it CR or anyone else, as the gospel truth. Folks need to seek out several sources, try the cars out for themselves, then make up their own mind. And I think that's just what most folks do.

CR isn't perfectly scientific; I'd argue that it's impossible and in fact undesirable to be, when it comes to evaluating cars. But CR makes a much more concerted and legitimate effort in that direction than any other evaluator of which I'm aware, and I have to respect that, even if the result frequently clashes with my own preferences and prejudices.

Yes, like the spokesman said, CR predicts future reliability based on past reliability where there is continuity of components. If there is no continuity, how can they predict; and if they can't predict, how can they recommend? So yes, this will prevent CR from recommending an all-new car until it's got a year of reliability data on it. For that matter, it will prevent CR from recommending an established car with a history of reliability problems until a full model year has gone by showing improved quality. But really, what's wrong with that? The alternative would be to make recommendations that aren't backed up by evidence, and that would be pointless.
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